[Editing] ESC Cancels Note Addition

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[Editing] ESC Cancels Note Addition

Postby usbpoweredfridge » Fri Nov 27, 2015 11:41 am

Hi Alex,

Was just testing something related to text clipping. I clipped some text, and just wanted to cancel the note. I hit ESC and the editor was closed - but the note was actually saved (ie it acted as if I had clicked Ok in the editor instead of Cancel). I'd expect the opposite behaviour based on all the other Windows programs I had used where ESC tends to cancel the current option and discards any changes you may have made - any chance of an option to make it so?

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Chris
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Re: [Editing] ESC Cancels Note Addition

Postby Ovg » Fri Nov 27, 2015 12:09 pm

Support!

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Re: [Editing] ESC Cancels Note Addition

Postby Thomas Lohrum » Fri Nov 27, 2015 2:32 pm

Hi,

i understand your concerns. Personally i like it that way a lot, as it supports a quick workflow. It should be optional, in case it will be implemented.

Thomas
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Re: [Editing] ESC Cancels Note Addition

Postby usbpoweredfridge » Sat Nov 28, 2015 1:17 am

Hi Thomas,

Indeed, yes - I meant for it to be optional. I've even be happy with default disabled (ie leave current behaviour as the default).

Regards,

Chris
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Re: [Editing] ESC Cancels Note Addition

Postby date » Sat Nov 28, 2015 1:19 pm

I agree it's counter-intuitive, but now that I'm used to it, actually helpful. (To cancel, is Alt-C by the way.)
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Re: [Editing] ESC Cancels Note Addition

Postby CintaNotes Developer » Mon Nov 30, 2015 1:34 pm

The behavor of ESC key initially was to cancel all changes and close the editor.
But then people started to complain that they have pressed Esc accidentally and lost valuable data.
After that I changed Esc to save the note.

I guess proper way to do this would be to cancel the changes, but leave a shadow copy in the Recycle Bin.
But since at that moment we only had time for a quick-and-dirty solution (even recycle bin didn't exist back then),
we have what we have ;)
Alex
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Re: [Editing] ESC Cancels Note Addition

Postby Thomas Lohrum » Mon Nov 30, 2015 6:46 pm

CintaNotes Developer wrote:I guess proper way to do this would be to cancel the changes, but leave a shadow copy in the Recycle Bin.

No. Definitely not. That would break my workflow entirely. A way to make it right is to show a yes/no/cancel dialog. To extend the feature, respectively to allow for the current workflow, is to have an option to not ask, but save automatically.

Thomas
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Re: [Editing] ESC Cancels Note Addition

Postby CintaNotes Developer » Tue Dec 01, 2015 3:33 am

Thomas Lohrum wrote:No. Definitely not. That would break my workflow entirely. A way to make it right is to show a yes/no/cancel dialog. To extend the feature, respectively to allow for the current workflow, is to have an option to not ask, but save automatically.


Hi Thomas, thanks for your input!
Personally I think that using a message box is a weak solution. How about this:
1) Implement note version history, add ability to return to any previous note state
2) Radically simplify UI, remove OK and Cancel buttons, leave just the X button in the window title, and Esc, both automatically saving changes
Alex
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Re: [Editing] ESC Cancels Note Addition

Postby usbpoweredfridge » Tue Dec 01, 2015 9:53 am

CintaNotes Developer wrote:2) Radically simplify UI, remove OK and Cancel buttons, leave just the X button in the window title, and Esc, both automatically saving changes

How is that any different to what it is now? Unless I am misunderstanding what you have in mind, aside from removing the buttons - a purely cosmetic change in this case IMHO - ESC will still save the note, regardless (ie no difference). If that is the case (no change to the ESC button function), I wonder why there is a need to change anything at all, you may as well leave things as they are.

Actually, it appears this change will make things worse for me - with it, it seems there will be no way to cancel the note as you will have removed the cancel button, which is the only way to actually discard the note now :( Please don't go backwards - I'd prefer things to stay as they are rather than become worse (even though ESC not cancelling the note doesn't work for me - I love using the ESC button to cancel stuff - I can actually discard a note at the moment by putting my hand on the mouse and moving it to the cancel button and I definitely do not want to lose the ability to discard a note).

Chris
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Re: [Editing] ESC Cancels Note Addition

Postby CintaNotes Developer » Wed Dec 02, 2015 7:39 am

usbpoweredfridge wrote:How is that any different to what it is now? Unless I am misunderstanding what you have in mind, aside from removing the buttons - a purely cosmetic change in this case IMHO - ESC will still save the note, regardless (ie no difference). If that is the case (no change to the ESC button function), I wonder why there is a need to change anything at all, you may as well leave things as they are.


I understand your concern here. Maybe not the best idea after all. How Evernote and OneNote do this btw?
Alex
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Re: [Editing] ESC Cancels Note Addition

Postby Thomas Lohrum » Wed Dec 02, 2015 8:24 am

Hi Alex,

CintaNotes Developer wrote:Personally I think that using a message box is a weak solution.

Weak or not, it's Standard!

I'd go for it and add an option for closing the editor using ESC:
1.) ask me
2.) save and exit silently (default)
3.) discard and exit silently

CintaNotes Developer wrote:1) Implement note version history, add ability to return to any previous note state
2) Radically simplify UI, remove OK and Cancel buttons, leave just the X button in the window title, and Esc, both automatically saving changes

Way to complex for the requirement here. Though i like versioning as a separate request, it has its own implications. For example first thing that comes to my mind: show me the diff between two versions :)

Thomas
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Re: [Editing] ESC Cancels Note Addition

Postby CintaNotes Developer » Thu Dec 03, 2015 9:55 am

Hi Thomas,

Weak or not, it's Standard!
I'd go for it and add an option for closing the editor using ESC:
1.) ask me
2.) save and exit silently (default)
3.) discard and exit silently

Probably this is one of the few cases where introducing an option is indeed beneficial.
However to start changing something I'll need to see some votes. This Chris is the one not satisfied
with the current behavior, I hope he'll kind enough to add the change request to the roadmap.

Way to complex for the requirement here. Though i like versioning as a separate request, it has its own implications. For example first thing that comes to my mind: show me the diff between two versions :)


That's a different feature already ;)
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Re: [Editing] ESC Cancels Note Addition

Postby usbpoweredfridge » Fri Dec 04, 2015 9:47 am

CintaNotes Developer wrote:How Evernote and OneNote do this btw?


Honestly, no idea I'm afraid. Maybe they don't let you cancel a note either.

Chris
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Re: [Editing] ESC Cancels Note Addition

Postby CintaNotes Developer » Mon Dec 07, 2015 6:59 am

usbpoweredfridge wrote:
CintaNotes Developer wrote:How Evernote and OneNote do this btw?


Honestly, no idea I'm afraid. Maybe they don't let you cancel a note either.

Chris


All right, never mind.
Anyhow, this is not the most pressing issue at the moment. I suggest we put it on ice for now.
Alex
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Re: [Editing] ESC Cancels Note Addition

Postby usbpoweredfridge » Mon Dec 07, 2015 9:53 am

Yeah, I think it needs more thought.

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Re: [Editing] ESC Cancels Note Addition

Postby yogi » Wed Dec 09, 2015 12:23 pm

hallo,
it is reasonable to have an escape key which does just that, cancel the action;
if notes is empty than cancel
if not than show dialoge box to protect from loss of already entered data.
Dialog boxes are not evil! No need for options here.
It would be a shame to put a simplifying suggestion on ice. I write simplifying because when keys do what the user expects thats good for the workflow.
Such changes are not so sensational as really new features but they harmonize the product, that is Cintanotes.

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Re: [Editing] ESC Cancels Note Addition

Postby CintaNotes Developer » Fri Dec 11, 2015 12:16 pm

Thanks for your opinion.
I feel that introducing another option is the only viable solution here.
Probably Esc should cancel by default (with a warning message box if there are unsaved changes).
But there would be a settings file option for Esc to save changes and close silently.
Alex
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Re: [Editing] ESC Cancels Note Addition

Postby Thomas Lohrum » Fri Dec 11, 2015 12:22 pm

CintaNotes Developer wrote:Thanks for your opinion.
I feel that introducing another option is the only viable solution here.
Probably Esc should cancel by default (with a warning message box if there are unsaved changes).
But there would be a settings file option for Esc to save changes and close silently.

Hi Alex,

i second as it makes CintaNotes easier for newbies, while still being powerful for power users.

Thomas
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Re: [Editing] ESC Cancels Note Addition

Postby usbpoweredfridge » Sat Dec 12, 2015 12:19 pm

Thirded :)

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Re: [Editing] ESC Cancels Note Addition

Postby CintaNotes Developer » Sun Dec 13, 2015 8:46 am

Ok, then its settled. Thanks for your input guys.
Alex

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